RCB Fair Mod Discussion

 nhoobish


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Join Date: 8 August 2010
Posts:3090
Posted 5 May 2017 - 4:14 pm
If you're a bad civ and forced to early hero and have to deal with someone that was fed to khan you're pretty much ****ed. If however, you early hero'ed (e.g. Charlemagne) and built bombards vs khan and that bombard 1 hit KO'ed Khans then you at least can reduce his pop a little bit before he kills you. There are many other instances where I think having the 1 hit kill on Khan is the better option.

I admit, I never thought about the beginning Tiny Island Khan because honestly... he's worthless. Idk who in their right mind would buy him. It's pretty much either Archers or rarely Paladins.

Celts should get some sort of boost in the beginning if they're truly the worst civ. Jesus... I wasn't wrong was I. They do suck ass.

I actually prefer picking Genghis Khan over Paladins, if my UU is a Foot Archer (not Chu Ko Nu). My reasoning behind it is that you are better of dealing more damage to the corner towers than attacking that 4000 HP gate for 5 minutes.

Once the league ends the bottom of the list will need buffs for sure.

Instead of reworking the map, we could change the HP/AP values for Khan and possibly the Attack Rate for Haralds aswell. But we can obviously reintroduce BBT attack bonus versus Khans.
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 Hitler_Naz1


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Posts:291
Posted 9 May 2017 - 6:55 am
Celt r weak only coz some civi went straight to khans which is v easy out these
here r civi that can get khans pretty easily
mongols pers spain sara turk china... these civi get khans without much effort.
furthermore don't forget noobs also played with these civi
spain is 2nd worst civi according to match stats
but I personally think that spain is most strongest civi in Rcb . tell me the name of a single civi that can owe spain in start or win base war vs spain (turks may b but none other not even pers or sara or korea)
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 Hitler_Naz1


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Posts:291
Posted 9 May 2017 - 6:57 am
another disaster I noticed in celt is that they hv 8+2 range of bbt.
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 nhoobish


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Posts:3090
Posted 9 May 2017 - 7:43 am
Time to give Celts Bracer and hope for the best?
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 [GG]Dark_Crystal


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Join Date: 28 January 2017
Posts:6
Posted 25 May 2017 - 4:48 am
i suggest mordator +100 hp need as they die so early
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 nhoobish


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Join Date: 8 August 2010
Posts:3090
Posted 29 May 2017 - 5:43 pm
Obversely wrote:
Total number of matches played: 284
Of which were
  • 5 player matches: 17
  • 6 player matches: 23
  • 7 player matches: 80
  • 8 player matches: 165
Civilization Statistics

Rank

1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
Civilization

Persians
Mongols
Huns
Saracens
Vikings
Japanese
Mayans
Chinese
Koreans
Turks
Goths
Aztecs
Franks
Britons
Teutons
Spanish
Byzantines
Celts

Winrate

20%
19%
18%
17%
16%
16%
14%
14%
13%
13%
12%
12%
11%
11%
10%
9%
9%
5%
Matches Won

24
24
21
21
19
16
20
15
17
13
13
13
13
12
12
10
12
5

Matches Played

118
124
116
124
119
103
140
108
126
101
110
113
118
109
125
108
133
108



As you can see from the list, certain civilizations are heavily underpowered and some are too good. It is however impacted by a player's knowledge and playstyle, but it is quite clear that Persians, Mongols and Huns may need a nerf, meanwhile Celts seriously need a buff along side with Teutons, Spanish, Byzantines.
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 Red_Lion


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Join Date: 26 March 2016
Posts:11
Posted 30 May 2017 - 12:10 pm
Make Beli Create 4sec/unit and Give Plate Barding Armor
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 Nexxus


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Join Date: 2 July 2007
Posts:8
Posted 31 May 2017 - 7:23 am
If Celts had Bracer and Thumb Ring research I think that would help with the win rate. The early game is not so bad if you play it right, but the late game is where they start to struggle. Right now, whenever I get Celts, I feel that I am forced to go Martel instead of Subo, Robin, or even Khan because their archers are weaker than other civs and will just end up feeding in the late game. They do have faster infantry, but if it's a fast-paced game where everyone is going for Khan, then Martel will end up just being food anyway.

This also applies to Teutons and Franks. These 3 civs are the only civs that have weak archers, and it really makes me think twice about taking an archer unit, which restricts my choices and late game opportunities.
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 [DZ]Devil_liveD


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Posts:332
Posted 11 June 2017 - 3:57 pm
Yeah accept to Rizi point , Spain is most strongest civ . The reason why win rate os low beacuse with spain people try to go higher heroes either Khans or theos. These guys get killed by players who get martels at earliest like vikings , aztecs . So it more depends upon player startegy.
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 MeTrOiD_WeaPoN


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Join Date: 12 May 2011
Posts:1255
Posted 16 June 2017 - 1:22 am
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1) Khan changed from 12 to 13 kings
2) Harald increased from 15 to 16 kings
3) Global increased from 19 to 21 kings
4) Bases redesigned, gates removed from objects villager can build
5) Villager buy on super store decreased from 4 kings to three kings.
6) Number of palisade walls that can be built increased from 75 to 100.

The following still needs to be done in the Fair Mod:
1) Make sure all units can upgrade their gates via the fortified wall tech.
2) Make sure palisade walls can die in one hit (i.e. still at 5 hp)
3) Possibly changing the unit class of palisade wall.

There you go.

I felt the changes with Khan/Harald/Global were necessary but maybe they weren't. Either way it may be fun for players to try that for awhile.

Another option for the future/now would be to change the unit class for palisade walls in fair mod too. That way beli/theo/actually all units would attack palisade wall like it was an actually unit. (Just an idea).

League is over. Time for implementation?
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 nhoobish


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Posts:3090
Posted 17 June 2017 - 12:32 pm
League is over. Time for implementation?

I do not handle rating requests. I will, however, do some changes to the mod today to address the civilization imbalances.
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 [xCs]HumTum


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Posts:68
Edited 17 June 2017 - 11:19 pm by [xCs]HumTum
League is over. Time for implementation?

RCB 2017 League (Redesign)

1) Khan changed from 12 to 13 kings
2) Harald increased from 15 to 16 kings
3) Global increased from 19 to 21 kings
4) Bases redesigned, gates removed from objects villager can build
5) Villager buy on super store decreased from 4 kings to three kings.
6) Number of palisade walls that can be built increased from 75 to 100.

The following still needs to be done in the Fair Mod:
1) Make sure all units can upgrade their gates via the fortified wall tech.
2) Make sure palisade walls can die in one hit (i.e. still at 5 hp)
3) Possibly changing the unit class of palisade wall.

There you go.

I felt the changes with Khan/Harald/Global were necessary but maybe they weren't. Either way it may be fun for players to try that for awhile.

Another option for the future/now would be to change the unit class for palisade walls in fair mod too. That way beli/theo/actually all units would attack palisade wall like it was an actually unit. (Just an idea).


well this will change rcb a lot and map will change into fun map but there are 2 options that will ruine defence alot .

3) Possibly changing the unit class of palisade wall.

it means if u have nevski then u just press 1 wall and they will hit auto to 2nd or 3rd wall to make enough gap this will be very bad u must try to break walls or even if you are theo you have to click 1 by 1 walls or click fast to destroy palaside walls it give other player time to survive or to die ( in case of fresh haralds or khans) thats is the funny part of rcb sometimes failed sometimes worked and its funny + huge luck + it makes you unique and without gates the map will completly change i mean first you will get enough space front to stand your army front 2 gates and you can make more gates in front of 2 gates which already built just like in 2011. make there many gates but not front [You must login to view link] will force people to buy bele/williams/theo which we hardly see in rcb games and it will reduce 2v1 3v1 4v1 because everyone have to defence their base but if you are going glob or harald then its natural you will get 2v1 3v1 4v1.

i really like weapon idea you can ask others :D
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 nhoobish


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Join Date: 8 August 2010
Posts:3090
Edited 18 June 2017 - 6:36 pm by nhoobish
The June update will be released 18.06.2017 09:00 GMT just because I am going to bed right now and people are playing games, so I rather not ruin their games by forcing an update during it.


Here is the list of changes and reasoning behind it
  • Bracer enabled for Celts.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Conquistador attack delay removed.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Cataphract movement speed increased to 1.45 from 1.35 to match Belisarius.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Bearded Axe technology now applies to all axethrowing infantry units.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Theodoric the Goth reload time reduced from 1.8 to 1.4 and movement speed increased from 1.05 to 1.15.
    Required to keep the unit impactful for its cost of kings.
  • William the Conqueror range increased from 0 to 1.
    Required to keep the unit impactful for its cost of kings.
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 MeTrOiD_WeaPoN


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Join Date: 12 May 2011
Posts:1255
Edited 18 June 2017 - 7:20 am by MeTrOiD_WeaPoN
nhoobish wrote:
The June update will be released 18.06.2017 09:00 GMT just because I am going to bed right now and people are playing games, so I rather not ruin their games by forcing an update during it.


Here is the list of changes and reasoning behind it
  • Bracer enabled for Celts.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Conquistador attack delay removed.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Cataphract movement speed increased to 1.45 from 1.35 to match Belisarius.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Bearded Axe technology now applies to all axethrowing infantry units.
    Due to the really bad winrate of the previous League it is clear they require a buff.
  • Theodoric the Goth reload time reduced from 1.8 to 1.4 and movement speed increased from 1.05 to 1.15.
    Required to keep the unit impactful for its cost of kings.
  • William the Conqueror range increased from 0 to 1.
    Required to keep the unit impactful for its cost of kings.
  • Genghis Khan attack damage reduced from 25 to 20 and movement speed reduced from 1.45 to 1.4.
    Currently too powerful for its cost of kings.

All changes are good except the last two imo.

Weakening khan won't stop people from buying the unit. Games will just last longer since khan is weaker. I'm speaking based on old memories but I don't think people will go global instead of khan with that change. They'll just get khan. Lengthening the end game cluster-****.

I don't think giving William a range of 1 will do anything since it doesn't use arrows/doesn't throw axes. I could be wrong. Did you test that at all?

On one hand I think the map changes I made should be implemented. On the other I'm still not going to be around to adjust anything. Up to the community. At least one guy above liked the changes.

Edit: Did you also give all civs fortified wall?


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 nhoobish


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Join Date: 8 August 2010
Posts:3090
Edited 18 June 2017 - 11:51 am by nhoobish
All changes are good except the last two imo.

Weakening khan won't stop people from buying the unit. Games will just last longer since khan is weaker. I'm speaking based on old memories but I don't think people will go global instead of khan with that change. They'll just get khan. Lengthening the end game cluster-****.

I don't think giving William a range of 1 will do anything since it doesn't use arrows/doesn't throw axes. I could be wrong. Did you test that at all?

On one hand I think the map changes I made should be implemented. On the other I'm still not going to be around to adjust anything. Up to the community. At least one guy above liked the changes.

Edit: Did you also give all civs fortified wall?

I decided to not give fortified walls yet since it affects civilization imbalance aswell.

My reasoning behind the Khan update was that, if the purchased unit is slightly weaker that player will be still considered dangerous, but also becomes easier to kill.

Last time I checked extra range should work fine, will double check just in case.

Need to ask Mich about rating the scenario and she will ask the players I suppose?


Edit:
[You must login to view link]

1) Khan changed from 12 to 13 kings
2) Harald increased from 15 to 16 kings
3) Global increased from 19 to 21 kings
4) Bases redesigned, gates removed from objects villager can build
5) Villager buy on super store decreased from 4 kings to three kings.
6) Number of palisade walls that can be built increased from 75 to 100.

The following still needs to be done in the Fair Mod:
1) Make sure all units can upgrade their gates via the fortified wall tech.
2) Make sure palisade walls can die in one hit (i.e. still at 5 hp)
3) Possibly changing the unit class of palisade wall.

There you go.

I felt the changes with Khan/Harald/Global were necessary but maybe they weren't. Either way it may be fun for players to try that for awhile.

Another option for the future/now would be to change the unit class for palisade walls in fair mod too. That way beli/theo/actually all units would attack palisade wall like it was an actually unit. (Just an idea).

People played this today, also sent a message to Mich, if it becomes rated, I will revert the Khan updates in the mod.

Question: Should we allow the building of Stone/Fortified walls for a crisp price of 50 or 100 (200) Stone per piece, would be unlimited.


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